ESWC Maps

[pksens]

Hello! Discussion time.

I spoke with Kryw and his idea is to have a diverse map list with different styles on each map so that it's not all drone spam. I can agree with the idea but only so far, because sometimes it can cost too much.

For example, Battlefield & Papercut appear similar maps with defensive setups already around the pole, with limited use of the map available to you. Papercut is quite a huge map, and I streamed a cup and watched the timer seeing it often took 20 seconds or longer for the attacker to finally engage in the map.

On the balance of the list; I feel that 3 out of the 7 maps aren't too enjoyable (Calypso, Battle, Papercut). On discussions with multiple teams, I am not alone. Nearly half the map list is a bit too much - I'd propose at least 1 map to be changed for a map that's proven to work. Remember, 7 maps for ESWC means it's important we have enough good maps to utilize.

If the ESWC map list replaced say Paper or Battle with Rust/Thust/Swift/old popular map then the map list would still retain it's diversity and the balance would be fun:
"Numb, Versace, Valiant, Breach, New Map, Battle, Calypso."

Personally I'd remove calypso etc but as I said they should retain that idea of diversity, so they'd opt to include a grass map to keep things different. If there is another grass map that's better, by all means !

I'd love just 1 map change to make the list far more enjoyable. We've still got a ton of weeks before ESWC so it's not much of an issue to think about changes at this stage I think. 2 map changes? I'd be very happy!

[novationx]

I dont know which maps we should add but I agree with everything else you said.
Battlefield, papercut and calypso are definately the maps that should be removed first.

You guys did a lovely stream but the maps were boring. Papercut is just a 20seconds wait = pfffffffffffffff
I always liked interrupto, but I know a lot of players dont share my opinion.


PS: Img , kryw or AERA shouldnt decide by themselves. You guys should vote together ( all qualified teams )

[Sephis]

On the balance of the list; I feel that 3 out of the 7 maps aren't too enjoyable (Calypso, Battle, Papercut).

I agree with you and I wouldn't mind if those maps get replaced by some old popular ones.

Letting the qualified teams vote on a few maps that would replace those is a good idea.

[bervt]

On the balance of the list; I feel that 3 out of the 7 maps aren't too enjoyable (Calypso, Battle, Papercut).

Papercut is too big and as say by Sens 20 sec to go to the pole , they wanted spectacle this is not the map for .
Battlefield fine map ,classical one , not the more interresting but more better than papercut .
Calypso I have removed it , because a lot of people don't like it ( really a lot about 80% ) so if it is on the mappool eswc it is easy to see who add it .

As far as i can see papercut and battlefield are the 2 chosen map to ban for bo5 .Why train 7 map since we only need 5...

[syzygy]

Papercut is too big and as say by Sens 20 sec to go to the pole , they wanted spectacle this is not the map for .

As far as i can see papercut and battlefield are the 2 chosen map to ban for bo5 .Why train 7 map since we only need 5...

100% agree here. the 2 added maps will be the vetos in bo5. seems img/aera chose the mappool and now they want to only practice vs each other on them. what a joke. wp an already small community.

whoever gave kryw.. a PLAYER in the eswc any right or authority to choose the maps is an absolute joke to begin with. each leader of the top teams over the last 6 months or the qualified teams should have been polled on what they would like to see in the eswc maps and then just have the top 7/9 added. no messing about. u take a simple email survey and implement it. facts and figures dont lie.

[bervt]

Letting the qualified teams vote on a few maps that would replace those is a good idea.

Not a good idea like this :
Kryw chose is map for the ESWC so it is a advantage for him and is team , right
so if you chose map it would be about the same .
But you can complain on the eswc ,not to Mathieux Dallon because he is friend with kryw but the big boss , if you present good argumentation about the map that you want to remove (not say just i don't like this map ), they will maybe hear you , and do something .(if you want contact PM me )

So tell the map to remove and sugest some to add .

It would be good if all the team complain .(exept IMG and AERA , you know why ).

[Keremz]

The 2 maps replacement seems to be a decent suggestion, especially when we know they're gonna get banned. Also, I like the idea of letting only qualified teams to get to vote.

[Livert]

Hey guys

I basically agree to everything mentioned so far. I wish you good luck for trying to make them remove one or two maps in order to replace them with better maps but I don´t think they´ll go for it...

That´s why I´m here to offer you another solution (consider it as a plan B). Since I´m the guy who built the original version of Papercut, I might be able to talk them into using an updated version which works better for competitive matches than the current one (but I can´t promise anything here). Therefore I would need some help with testing the updates because the changes would need to happen pretty fast...

The feedback about this map was so far that it´s too huge and that it´s taking way too long to get to the pole where all the action takes place...

I´ve created a first update where I basically only made the map a lot smaller and changed the positions of the spawns. You can download it here: http://sm.mania-exchange.com/tracks/view/12668

Please let me know if it´s working better this way and what still needs to be changed. (I didn´t have a lot of time when I made the changes so the timing at the start could not be working perfect yet).

Thanks for your feedback guys

EDIT: Just got the allowance to create an updated version

[pksens]

Livert, thanks but what about an actual proven map that we've all played and worked on? Why the insistence on PaperCut? I know you authored it, but, there has to be a point where you are doing us damage by this bias.

[UrinStein]

(consider it as a plan B).

Why the insistence on PaperCut?

Maybe, no matter if the map stays in the pool or not, he insists on working on his map, as long as he gets feedback? Isn't that part of what makes a good mapper?