[Request] Change title pack for direct download

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phil13hebert
Posts: 564
Joined: 29 Oct 2011, 14:11
Location: Québec

[Request] Change title pack for direct download

Post by phil13hebert »

So basically, what I'm asking for is that title packs are replaced by a direct download when you enter a server. There's plenty of advantages over title packs and I'll show you why I'm not okay with them.

Why am I asking for this?
Well first, in my opinion, title packs are just a blocker. Why? They need to be found by the player, then downloaded, then added to a station, then you can play it by entering the station. This causes a big problem, everything is fragmented. In fact, you wanted ManiaPlanet to be something that includes all game in one big gaming platform to not separate the community, but with title packs, it's totally the inverse.

The community, as small as it is right now, is even smaller for each titles, because some are in the elite gamemode (wich could be in storm because it doesn't need custom content) while some are in storm so this divide players even more.

I can understand that title packs are used to separate environment and game (ie: storm, canyon, valley, stadium), but even for this, shootmania, trackmania and questmania only should be in 3 differents title. But that's not the goal of my post.


Why is my request better than title packs?
Everything would be faster and easier for everyone.
I am quite skilled with computer and I love to explore so it's easy for me to understand how title packs work, but if I take my brother who's not like me, it's quite different. When I talk of a new mode (ie: obstacle), he can't join me in my server rapidly, because he needs to install the title pack. The problem is that he doesn't know how.

I'm pretty sure that my brother isn't the only one who can't do it. When going on the game, it should be quite easy to join someone or to play a new game mode that you saw in the server list.

Back on the question. In other games where there's custom content made by the community, it's always easy to download it and play it. One of the best example is the way Valve do it. When you enter a server with custom content, you download it at the load screen. Right after the download is complete, you can play in the server with your custom content. In my opinion, this is a great way of downloading the custom content. As I said before, it's easier for the player and also faster.

Now you will tell me that in some case, it's not faster. I know that sometimes, mods or other things could be a problem, but these can be downloaded while playing in the server. They are not needed as soon as the player want to join the server. On the other hands, custom actions or weapons aren't big files and can be downloaded quickly.


How could this work?
I will base my examples on shootmania for this part. All servers should be in the storm station, even elite, obstacle, etc. one. You should add next to the server name or mode or whatever if it's a server with custom content or not. You could also show the size of the files and if the player already have them in the cache or somewhere.

When the players would join the custom server, it would first download the files in the load screen, then load the map and then he could play.

For servers with files that are let's say greater than 100 mb, it would be possible do download files in parallel while playing on another server or while doing something else on ManiaPlanet.


To finish
I seriously don't get how title packs are useful. Yes we can have a separate ladder, but there's not enough advantages to benefit from title packs.

I am now questioning myself for my custom game mode. I am currently developing a gungame mode with custom weapons and I have a server up and running. For now people add the actions in their personal folder, but some of them ask me : why are we obligated to download them and add them manually to be able to play? It should be done via the game. Then I tell them that I need to create a title pack if they want to have that "feature". When they hear this answer, they tell me that they don't get it. "Why should you put this in a title pack?" they said.

My game mode only requires custom weapons + the script to run the mode. This is like 1mb. Why couldn't they join my server, it downloads required files and they're in having fun in my mode. No, they need to add my useless title pack in a station to play in my server.

Title packs can be useful for solo play with campaigns, but for my mode and many mode it's 100% useless. My dream is that one day, downloads will be much more easy and that everything will be at the same place to have only one great community. :)
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fleo
Posts: 304
Joined: 02 Sep 2011, 12:56

Re: [Request] Change title pack for direct download

Post by fleo »

Titlepacks are not only about custom files and ladders. Don't forget things like vanilla-mode.I think Nadeo wanted to separate "classic modes" to the others in which we can change weapon, modify gameplay, ...

I developed a pack recently and I believe when someone tries to join me when he sees me in the Storm servers list, he's proposed to download the pack and everything is automated now. I have to admit sometimes it doesn't work and just stay stuck in a state or another. But if this system would work, joining a titlepack you've never played would be very smooth and easy.

I just don't get why we have to pay to add new empty stations... and also why we end in a titlepack menu after playing it when we previously joined the server from the Storm station, it's just confusing...
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steeffeen
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Re: [Request] Change title pack for direct download

Post by steeffeen »

also see this post by Cerovan which covers some of the issues with direct file download: http://forum.maniaplanet.com/viewtopic. ... 02#p201302

it's certainly true that having to download content often can be annoying
but the solution can't be to not let players join these servers at all

i'm thinking of two different alternatives to the current system which i want to explain shortly
(even though i know that the lead nadeo guys don't want to change their plans)

direct file download
- the server maintains a list of his used files
- checksum comparison of the files on the list and download of them if needed
- the files are of course hosted somewhere else and don't get transferred by the server as that might cause lags
- the files are placed inside login/project/gamemode based subfolders to avoid naming issues
-> instead of a title pack with my name in it i have a folder with my used files

content packs
- like it's supposed to be possible to put skins into .gbx files to "sell" them we generate content pack .gbx files with our custom files
- the game mode + server has list of the used content packs and the clients download them if necessary (see direct file download)
- naming issues can be solved similar to the current title pack naming "Name@Login"
- this way you could create a game mode that uses the files of someone else like a library
-> one could imagine someone creating various custom weapons and offering them via his content packs
- like that the custom content couldn't be abused by others because the files aren't downloaded directly and aren't accessible directly

outcome
- a global server browser that has additional easy filters for "only vanilla without custom content" and "with custom content"
-> this solves the "i just want a quick game without the need to download something" issue
- access to the custom content without the need to download it before being able to see it
- don't you think that last point makes way more sense? usually you don't want to search for something to know that it even exists, right? instead you want to see it and THEN get to know it (by downloading it and joining the server)
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