Destiny of titlepacks + consequences

[Soprah]

Maniaplanet is all about diversity: Giving players the opportunity to create whatever they want. Attractive movies, innovative game modes, smooth maps, interesting manialinks. And titlepacks as well. Everyone wants their creation to be successful for example the most titlepack creators intended to create a competitive game mode which would be played by tons of people.

Exactly this is the crucial point. Due to the fact that everyone is able to create their own titlepack, there are a lot titlepacks. But, unfortunately, it is simply not possible that each titlepack is played by a broad mass of players and thus, satisfy the titlepack creator's desire of a successful/popular titlepack. Do not get me wrong! I love all the custom titlepacks with its awesome & innovative game modes such as hunger games, speedball, Loadout mode compilation, battlepro etc. But the current playerbase is not able to achieve that.

Somebody could assume that a bigger playerbase could solve this issue (e.g. by the new universal demo), but I doubt that. The more players Maniaplanet has, the more custom content (here: Titlepacks) would be created. I am not a math genius but here is a little math example to make it a bit clearer, hopefully:

Current SM playerbase = 1p
Current amount of titlepacks = 8t
-> I chosed the 1 to 8 ratio because the playerbase is only able to play 12,5% of the current titlepacks actively (actively = a stable and high amount of players, e.g. always 70players). Obviously, the ratio is not really calculated to the real data of titlepacks and the playerbase. I would rather like to portray that the playerbase is only able to play a very few amount of titlepacks actively.
If we would multiply the playerbase by 2, we would get these numbers:
Doubled SM playerbase: 2p
Doubled amount of titlepacks: 16t
-> Keep in mind of my theory which I explained above: More players, more content (here: titlepacks) is created.

There would be still only a few titlepacks that would be played actvively (e.g. Elite) and the rest would be still spread among other titlepacks/storm modes. The most titlepacks would be still characterized by a low playerbase and as a result, empty servers. Well, there would be probabaly a few more actively played titlepacks than only Elite (i.e. Combo or joust?) but still the most titlepacks would suffer from the big amount of titlepacks compared to the rather low playerbase.

A few more consequences of the issue I've mentioned above:

+ Competition among the titlepack creators
Everyone wants their own titlepack to be popular. This leads to a competition among the creators and they will be eagerly trying to create the best titlepack. The more titlepacks are created, the bigger is the competitions among the creators, the better titlepacks would be created.
=> innovativity & qualitivity

- Frustration of the creators from less popular titleapacks & frustration of interested titlepack creators
Not everyone is able to create such a superb, awesome innovative game mode and would most likely not achieve success. Firstly, current titlepack creator see no sense to make any effort for their titlepack anymore. They lose their motivation and might give up supporting their titlepack. Secondly, players who are interested in learning the tools to create a titlepack might recognize that only a very few amount of titlepacks are actively played and lose their motivation as well.
=> Less activity

I will add more consequences if I come up with any good aspect

What do you think?

Regards,
Soprah

[novationx]

More players would mean more titlepack creators. This means that the extra players will also be divided amongst all (including the new) titles (especially Elite & other popular modes)...It's a vicious circle. So, Im starting to think that having a popular title is extremely hard/dificult.

Less titlepacks, but of better quality, would be better in a way.
But reducing 'freedom to create' would also be bad.

Interesting discussion and I dont know the answer.

We already got the store. We got this weekday for each title ( I dont think this really had a note-worthy effect, but I love the effort NADEO put into this. ) What else can we/NADEO do?

I think that :
1. The titlepack creator should use every tool available to promote his title. ( including a post here, a trailer or gameplay video, posts on the newsfeed, enabling the title-weekday )... He really cant do more.

2. NADEO ( inc the community ) should find a way to attract a lot more players.
Then & only then a titlepack could become popular eventually.


Another suggestion:
- Grouping several gamemodes into 1 big title ( just like loadout ). But who should do this? Should titlepack-creators work together? Do they wanna work together? Maybe someone official should do it?
Im not even sure if its a good suggestion.

[UrinStein]

Another suggestion:
- Grouping several gamemodes into 1 big title ( just like loadout ). But who should do this? Should titlepack-creators work together? Do they wanna work together? Maybe someone official should do it?
Im not even sure if its a good suggestion.

The problem is the amount of gamemodes not titlepacks. You're not going to have more people on Battle if you put it in one title with Joust...

While putting some smaller and fun movement based gamemodes into the Obstacle TP you could raise the interest in those, but if it works it would just take away people from Obstacle and put them into another mode...

[novationx]

Im not even sure if its a good suggestion.

Also, IF there will be any grouping it should be "logical" as in your example. For me thats obvious :p so I didnt include it in my prev post.

[TGYoshi]

I'm personally just avoiding everything requiring titlepacks since I know everyone's too lazy to find/install/etc a titlepack anyway. Why would I even bother?

Things like embedded objects just work, anyone who wants to give a map with my creations a shot can with a single click!

Too bad there's that silly 150 kB limit and other things can't be shared without titlepacks. Which is sad imo, I think they're the main reason the whole platform feels (maybe is/causes the feeling of being) so dead (combined with fundamentally flawed matchmaking in sm; just another thing not thought out at all).

[meuh21]

Don't forget the title pack story just begin

I think now stay in Maniaplanet the "core" community. And in this "core" we find many creators. So even if player base will be x10, it will not be the same for the title packs. And it take times and competences to build a title pack. It's not a feature for begginers. But it's a nice goal for them.

The main question is : what should be a title pack ? For me (just my opinion) a title pack should have many features : gamemode, mods, solo campaign, servers, items, etc and a special spirit. Of course every body can do what he wants, but i prefer to see a collaboration between a trackbuilder, a items creator and a modder than to see 3 title packs.

I suggest the possibility to build external solo campaigns on title packs : http://forum.maniaplanet.com/viewtopic. ... 21&t=29335

The situation is different between SM and TM. More possibilities in Shootmania but Title packs are almost only Gamemod. Is it enough for a title pack ? How many SM titlepacks have mods ?

I would like also to see community project. But to be more ambitious we need more possibilities, especially in TM where we have less features (bots, forced characters) than Shootmania. The title pack future is something like that : http://forum.maniaplanet.com/viewtopic. ... t=monolith

I hope to see titlepaks with a atmosphere, something special and different. Right now it is difficult to do that. In the future it could be possible.

And don't forget : even if just a few people play title packs, it's better than if players play other games. With titlepacks players could stay in Maniaplanet.

[haenry]

I think now stay in Maniaplanet the "core" community. And in this "core" we find many creators. So even if player base will be x10, it will not be the same for the title packs. And it take times and competences to build a title pack. It's not a feature for begginers. But it's a nice goal for them.

I think this will be a bit different. New players means that there are creators amongst them. Why do I think so? Among the players who already joined us, there was a certain amount of creators too. So it will be the same in the future. More palyers => more creators.
Besides that more creators is a good thing actually

The main question is : what should be a title pack ? For me (just my opinion) a title pack should have many features : gamemode, mods, solo campaign, servers, items, etc and a special spirit. Of course every body can do what he wants, but i prefer to see a collaboration between a trackbuilder, a items creator and a modder than to see 3 title packs.

Yes I agree with you on that. I (probably) will play a titlepack that offers a lot of content.
However, the problem is that not everyone wants to create such a huge titlepack with a lot of features for various reasons (They don't have enough time, don't like to code or have no motivation to build 30 quality maps for a solo campaign, nor do they have a concept for an online ladder.. etc.)

So let's take a look at players, who just want to use ONE features maniaplanet provides. Let's take the 17 year old PlayerA, who likes to code and wants to write a new gamemode. How shall he provide an entire titlepack full of features that players would download, if he cannot provide any additional features besides the mode script? (let's assume here that he dislikes creating maps, is not good at image editing =>cannot create mods, etc.)

On the other side there are Player B, Player C and Player D, who love to build race tracks and now want to try their luck with objects. They probably hear about embedding, but notice really quickly that their possibilities are limited (due to 150kb limit). So everyone of them creates a Titlepack, so they can use as many objects as they want, although they just have enough time to build this one map. So we end up with 3 Titlepacks that only contain one map each. Maybe Player D has holidays at the moment and creates 4 more maps within the next 2 weeks, so that his Titlepack has 5 maps.

But who is going to download all these Titlepacks for just a few or even just one map(s)? Players whose slots are arleady full and cannot afford more? Players who like to race online with friends? Players who love to hunt solo campaigns?

[novationx]

I think now stay in Maniaplanet the "core" community. And in this "core" we find many creators. So even if player base will be x10, it will not be the same for the title packs. And it take times and competences to build a title pack. It's not a feature for begginers. But it's a nice goal for them.

I think this will be a bit different. New players means that there are creators amongst them. Why do I think so? Among the players who already joined us, there was a certain amount of creators too. So it will be the same in the future. More palyers => more creators.
Besides that more creators is a good thing actually

The main question is : what should be a title pack ? For me (just my opinion) a title pack should have many features : gamemode, mods, solo campaign, servers, items, etc and a special spirit. Of course every body can do what he wants, but i prefer to see a collaboration between a trackbuilder, a items creator and a modder than to see 3 title packs.

Yes I agree with you on that. I (probably) will play a titlepack that offers a lot of content.
However, the problem is that not everyone wants to create such a huge titlepack with a lot of features for various reasons (They don't have enough time, don't like to code or have no motivation to build 30 quality maps for a solo campaign, nor do they have a concept for an online ladder.. etc.)

So let's take a look at players, who just want to use ONE features maniaplanet provides. Let's take the 17 year old PlayerA, who likes to code and wants to write a new gamemode. How shall he provide an entire titlepack full of features that players would download, if he cannot provide any additional features besides the mode script? (let's assume here that he dislikes creating maps, is not good at image editing =>cannot create mods, etc.)

On the other side there are Player B, Player C and Player D, who love to build race tracks and now want to try their luck with objects. They probably hear about embedding, but notice really quickly that their possibilities are limited (due to 150kb limit). So everyone of them creates a Titlepack, so they can use as many objects as they want, although they just have enough time to build this one map. So we end up with 3 Titlepacks that only contain one map each. Maybe Player D has holidays at the moment and creates 4 more maps within the next 2 weeks, so that his Titlepack has 5 maps.

But who is going to download all these Titlepacks for just a few or even just one map(s)? Players whose slots are arleady full and cannot afford more? Players who like to race online with friends? Players who love to hunt solo campaigns?

10/10 problem-analysis.
That was something I was trying to explain too.

The --->only<--- "succesful" titlepack that Ive seen is "loadout". ( yes yes, some others are very good too )
but he is one of the first to actually bundle his gamemodes to 1 title & he is doing everything to get the best out of his titlepack. This makes so much sense instead of making 28titles for every seperate idea one has.

[djhubertus]

So let's take a look at players, who just want to use ONE features maniaplanet provides. Let's take the 17 year old PlayerA, who likes to code and wants to write a new gamemode. How shall he provide an entire titlepack full of features that players would download, if he cannot provide any additional features besides the mode script? (let's assume here that he dislikes creating maps, is not good at image editing =>cannot create mods, etc.)

Well, this description is about me so I want to put my 2 cents. I'm only coding to gain experience in future, I built 3 tactical gamemodes and the reason, why I built titlepack are stupid vanilla restrictions in Storm title like weapon switching for example. That's why gamemodes in Storm are boring cause it shows the simplification of this game "how much" main game has. You think new players know about titlepacks? Nope, newbies are only playing Battle, Siege, Royal and Elite cause it's downloaded with Demo. Nadeo are providing tools and nothing more.

PS.

The --->only<--- "succesful" titlepack that Ive seen is "loadouts". ( yes yes, some others are very good too )
but he is one of the first to actually bundle his gamemodes to 1 title & he is doing everything to get the best out of his titlepack. This makes so much sense instead of making 28titles for every seperate idea one has.

I'm glad you like it