TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

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dePaljas
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by dePaljas » 23 Oct 2018, 20:49

Disabled all filtering and antialiasing in-game.
Drivers (NVidia CP) does not mention viewing distance, nor mipmap settings.
Tried the speed vs. quality slider of the CP.
Disabled/reenabled the high definition textures.

All without luck.

I think you for all suggestions and comments.. I give up. I'll just set the negative LOD to clamp and accept it as least painful ;).
[Mobo: FOXCONN A7DA-S/A7DA] [CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 940 BE] [Memory: 4GB] [Video: MSI 660 Ti]

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TMarc
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by TMarc » 23 Oct 2018, 22:28

I'm sorry that you are having such issues. :oops:
I had not, neither with the GTX 560 Ti nor with the current one.

Last try 1: try a complete uninstall of the driver (using a driver cleaner)

Last try 2: DirectX settings. They can also be affected.
Do you have the SDK installed by chance?
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dePaljas
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by dePaljas » 24 Oct 2018, 18:29

Thanks for mentioning the 560 Ti, I was wondering also whether it might be a restriction of the 660 Ti, but if the 560 is OK, not likely (assuming 660 would be an improvement). Yet perhaps the problems were only introduced in later versions of Maniaplanet, and you stopped using the 560 before then?..

I'll try the driver full uninstall. [update] Did it, used NVidia's installer clean install option first, no improvement. Then used an additional cleanup utility in between uninstalling and reinstalling the driver. Still no improvement.

I'm not using an SDK. In fact I installed W10 not that long ago.

What do you suggest I do/check about DirectX, and how?
[Mobo: FOXCONN A7DA-S/A7DA] [CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 940 BE] [Memory: 4GB] [Video: MSI 660 Ti]

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TMarc
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by TMarc » 24 Oct 2018, 20:05

Yeah, I was using the 560 before Windows 10. The 970 came when I built a new PC, to be used with Windows 7 and now 10.

Hm, the DirectX settings cannot be configured "anymore", I thought there was some tool, but I might remember of some tool of the DirextX SDK as well.

All necessary settings should be configurable either via the nVidia Control Panel, the Geforce Experience or Maniaplanet.

In Maniaplanet, I'm using high definition textures, no Antialiasing, Anisotropic filter 4x (settings based on "Very nice" and then customized).

Ok, I have to admit that I can also see some Moiré, but it is not as dramatic as in your video. I'm running at 2560x1440, perhaps the higher resolution helps (although it makes the game slower on my system).
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dePaljas
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by dePaljas » 24 Oct 2018, 21:12

Yep the resolution might help. I'll try play with scaling a bit, artificially oversampling that way.

Also.. I just read the [ok] video's (see opening post) description and read:
Useless fun fact: rendered this at 100x AA. Do you see a difference to 25x AA? Me neither.
So there you have it.. I just lost the one hard proof that what I'm seeing is beyond normal :D.

Anyway, I've created a series of screenshots to show the differences of several settings for me. Note that I cannot accurately demonstrate the DSR, since when you take a screenshot, it will record the full resolution image before scaling and smoothing. But just take it from me that it's not that much better and still shows significant moire effect.

If you want to compare, I've uploaded the map here: https://ufile.io/1dtqt.

aa16Image
aa16, fxaaImage
aa16, dsr x4Image
aa4, lod=clampImage
aa16, lod=clampImage
aa16, lod=clamp, fxaaImage
[Mobo: FOXCONN A7DA-S/A7DA] [CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 940 BE] [Memory: 4GB] [Video: MSI 660 Ti]

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riolu
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by riolu » 25 Oct 2018, 00:08

I can't contribute a lot to this problem, but to clarify one thing since you liked a video of mine:
The video shows rendered footage at 100x AA, hence no graphical artifacts being visible anywhere. Such high AA is not achievable in real-time, so comparing rendered footage with actual gameplay is not appropriate. Just a little heads-up here :thumbsup:

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dePaljas
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by dePaljas » 25 Oct 2018, 05:53

Thanks for confirming Riolu, that was indeed the point made in my previous post.
[Mobo: FOXCONN A7DA-S/A7DA] [CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 940 BE] [Memory: 4GB] [Video: MSI 660 Ti]

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Miss
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by Miss » 25 Oct 2018, 09:45

Definitely looks like that texture is missing mipmaps for some reason.. :/
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dePaljas
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by dePaljas » 25 Oct 2018, 17:57

Any reference picture of another machine with same settings would be appreciated. Preferably with similar vcard but that is a stretch 😉
[Mobo: FOXCONN A7DA-S/A7DA] [CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 940 BE] [Memory: 4GB] [Video: MSI 660 Ti]

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Electron
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Re: TM2 MP4 Stadium wallride and looping transparency moire

Post by Electron » 26 Oct 2018, 00:01

I also have this problem since today (GTX 1060). And I was not able to eliminate the extreme Moiré so far.
I still have to test if other games are affected as well.

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