Stadium environment map mixing?

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adsun
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by adsun » 26 Oct 2015, 16:15

Cerovan wrote:It was more like also you have to create map specifically think for a Canyon or Valley car in Stadium (due to the physic) which is not particularly the case the other way.
If you'd follow that logic, you would also have to forbid the other mixes. A map always has to be desinged with the right car in mind. If you take a Canyon map and slap the Stadium or Valley car on there it is not going to be a good map.
TMarc wrote:Canyon and Valley car physics do not allow driving on Stadium.
I actually built a Stadium map with the Valley car for the short time period where it was possible. The mix works really well, especially since the Stadium block set is more diverse and the blocks are smaller. A shame it got banned. I agree, that Canyon on Stadium feels a bit odd, but so does Canyon on Valley imo.

It really surprised me that you blocked these mixes. It just does not seem to follow the idea of providing the players with the tools to create good content. Especially since you introduced ingame bloc mixing.

nailbomb69
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by nailbomb69 » 26 Oct 2015, 18:29

What features do canyon and valley have that stadium doesn't?

jui
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by jui » 26 Oct 2015, 18:33

adsun wrote:
Cerovan wrote:It was more like also you have to create map specifically think for a Canyon or Valley car in Stadium (due to the physic) which is not particularly the case the other way.
If you'd follow that logic, you would also have to forbid the other mixes. A map always has to be desinged with the right car in mind. If you take a Canyon map and slap the Stadium or Valley car on there it is not going to be a good map.
TMarc wrote:Canyon and Valley car physics do not allow driving on Stadium.
I actually built a Stadium map with the Valley car for the short time period where it was possible. The mix works really well, especially since the Stadium block set is more diverse and the blocks are smaller. A shame it got banned. I agree, that Canyon on Stadium feels a bit odd, but so does Canyon on Valley imo.

It really surprised me that you blocked these mixes. It just does not seem to follow the idea of providing the players with the tools to create good content. Especially since you introduced ingame bloc mixing.
+1
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TMarc
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by TMarc » 26 Oct 2015, 19:22

disposableaccount wrote:nothing but excuses, the posts above said everything so i won't even bother.
Then please stop bothering us here, with your attitude, this would be much better :roll:

I'm wondering where you think TMT will be that much better since it is based on the same engine.
If you find your luck there, good for you :pil
adsun wrote:If you'd follow that logic, you would also have to forbid the other mixes. A map always has to be desinged with the right car in mind. If you take a Canyon map and slap the Stadium or Valley car on there it is not going to be a good map.
You explain yourself exactly why Nadeo does not allow this for the masses. :thumbsup:
It is somehow like with the block mixing. Everyone wants to have it, everyone wants to use it.
If done by experienced users, maps will be great, otherwise they will be undriveable.
And who will be blamed? Of course always Nadeo, right? :?
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TGYoshi
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by TGYoshi » 26 Oct 2015, 19:35

TMarc wrote:
adsun wrote:If you'd follow that logic, you would also have to forbid the other mixes. A map always has to be desinged with the right car in mind. If you take a Canyon map and slap the Stadium or Valley car on there it is not going to be a good map.
You explain yourself exactly why Nadeo does not allow this for the masses. :thumbsup:
It is somehow like with the block mixing.
If done by experienced users, maps will be great, otherwise they will be undriveable.
And who will be blamed? Of course always Nadeo, right? :?
Maps will be trash if it's built in a trashy way. It doesn't matter what car you slap on it, you'll have to adapt the map to it. Nando isn't to blame there, but disallowing some combinations makes no sense to prevent that from happening as it's unavoidable. Which is fine.

They claimed they had "special plans" (not specified further) with the Stadium environment years ago. For "that reason" it was disabled. Meanwhile every other Nando member specifies another reason.
Honestly, the whole situation at Nadeo seems like a huge mess. Seems like they're stuck in some ancient development methodology ;).
=3

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TMarc
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by TMarc » 26 Oct 2015, 19:41

Yes, you're right, TGYoshi.
On the other hand, they allowed 64x64 maps for the quite interesting RPG maps.
And we got the gravity settings (unfortunately the project that was demanding it most has stopped for unknown time.).
So we can't say "they do nothing". ;)

I think we have to wait for the release of TMT and of Maniapanet 4.0 to see what will really be changed then.
The eternal "be patient" mantra :lol:
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TGYoshi
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by TGYoshi » 26 Oct 2015, 19:52

Waiting is pointless if you don't know what the hell you're waiting for.
Enjoy the game as it is, share your feedback with Nando (and the community), like this person does, and hope Nando acknowledges the change. Get excited and wait for an update once Nando announces their plans (like people did with the gravity thing).
Or stop spending time on making things change within the game if you don't feel like waiting eternally while not knowing what you're waiting for. You'll just be disappointed otherwise.

As Nando really seems stuck in some methodology which worked years ago with a static shot product (like all TM1's were) and tries to apply this on a dynamic product (NandoPlonet, the ultimate Operating System!), without announcing anything, we're all just sitting here, waiting on .. something? I'm not, at least :thumbsup: .

Don't be patient unless you know what to expect. Don't expect this to change unless Nando announces they'll change it. Again, you'll just be disappointed.
=3

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adsun
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by adsun » 26 Oct 2015, 19:59

The biggest problem is, that there is a huge difference between not implementing a certain feature, such as adjustable gravity (just an example, I know we have it :D ), but actually actively excluding one. The Stadium mixing was possible before, so someone actually had to sit down and write code that sets the Stadium car at load of a stadium map.
TMarc wrote:You explain yourself exactly why Nadeo does not allow this for the masses.
It is somehow like with the block mixing.
Seems like you got my point wrong. As you say, it is exactly like with bloc mixing. You can build great tracks, but you can also build a horrible track with it. It is just a tool. The person who uses the tool is responsible for building something good or something horrible, not the tool.

Also: What TGYoshi says.

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TMarc
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by TMarc » 26 Oct 2015, 20:22

Good reasoning, adsun :)

Then, instead of just complaining, we should ask for multi-car feature including the respective physics.
WWSC - We Want StadiumCar :pil

And to go further, in a future version of the editor, blocks could get highlighted in red or be unplaceable if they are not suitable for the currently selected car.
What do you think?
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adsun
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Re: Stadium environment map mixing?

Post by adsun » 26 Oct 2015, 22:09

I like the WWSC :clap:
But as you might expect the idea of excluding certain blocs for certain cars again just sounds unnecessary and like way too much of work. People always come up with creative ways for bloc usage, so who is there to decide if a bloc is suited or not.

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