Official Exp v1.3 feedback

[Kyb]

Not in the least I would like to use it as my argument (since it would liken me to the likes of frostbeule), but nevertheless I'd like to point it out: just look objectively at how much people play the classic Elite, and Elite exp. From what I can see, people barely play Elite exp now. And though I cannot speak for others, why they prefer the classic Elite, and so on, I can say why I opt for ignoring the novelties.

It does not necessarily come from the fact that players don't like the new features, but they may prefer to train on the mode in which the competition takes place.

[Gillz]

I'll post what I've posted in other threads. I would test more, but honestly the movement just feels too unresponsive.

in regards to netcode and hitboxes, one or the other should of been changed. it's too hard to gauge the changes if it's a reduced hitbox AND netcode change. honestly right now it doesn't feel good for the attacker, I play with a 40 ping and I still hit lots of interpolated shots, as well as die when I'm 100% behind a wall.

change something back, either the hitbox or netcode change. It doesn't feel any better, if anything it's a lot harder to hit shots on attack, and for me, most of the shots that do hit look like they shouldn't of. I'm getting too many shots where they visually hit, and they don't.

Don't like three rockets instead of four, a common situation is one attacker vs one defender, the attacker having full hp (3hp). With 4 rockets, if you played smart at the pole, you could have one to spam, and always have three in your reserve. If you were good with the rockets, and your attacker missed, you could get a good chance of killing the attacker.

With 3 rockets, you can't spam any while at the pole, because even if you hit two after, you're recharging and are frantically waiting for that third. Four rockets is good for elite, lowering it to three means the defender doesn't have a chance to spam any rockets or keep the attacker away, meaning the attacker has a free walkway to the pole, almost all the time.

Just my thoughts.

movement feels way too slow. try moving in a circle (left, back, right, forward), the radius of the circle is a lot bigger compared to doing it in regular elite.

I don't like being able to shoot rockets. most of the time when I hit the rockets its because I was trying to hit an opponent and he shot a rocket, it's always easier to dodge them. hitting them is a waste of a shot too, and if they push you, and you shoot a rocket, they have more of an opportunity to push you.

Walljumps feel random. They seem like they don't work half the time. You should be able to select what direction you want to move by the key you hold.

I'll comment on the rest the more I play.

[Kryw]

I don't like 3 rockets, I don't have pleasure to play with that

[JayTac]

I don't think wall jumping needs to turn into Warsow, there's a point where it becomes a little too ridiculous imo.

I hear a lot people complain about movement being sluggish, but I haven't experienced any drawbacks to movement in exp. In regards to movement in general (Storm and exp), why are jumps so floaty? It doesn't feel like I'm jumping it feels like I'm floating/sailing (basic jumps even).

[JayTac]

I'll post what I've posted in other threads. I would test more, but honestly the movement just feels too unresponsive.

in regards to netcode and hitboxes, one or the other should of been changed. it's too hard to gauge the changes if it's a reduced hitbox AND netcode change. honestly right now it doesn't feel good for the attacker, I play with a 40 ping and I still hit lots of interpolated shots, as well as die when I'm 100% behind a wall.

change something back, either the hitbox or netcode change. It doesn't feel any better, if anything it's a lot harder to hit shots on attack, and for me, most of the shots that do hit look like they shouldn't of. I'm getting too many shots where they visually hit, and they don't.

Don't like three rockets instead of four, a common situation is one attacker vs one defender, the attacker having full hp (3hp). With 4 rockets, if you played smart at the pole, you could have one to spam, and always have three in your reserve. If you were good with the rockets, and your attacker missed, you could get a good chance of killing the attacker.

With 3 rockets, you can't spam any while at the pole, because even if you hit two after, you're recharging and are frantically waiting for that third. Four rockets is good for elite, lowering it to three means the defender doesn't have a chance to spam any rockets or keep the attacker away, meaning the attacker has a free walkway to the pole, almost all the time.

Just my thoughts.

movement feels way too slow. try moving in a circle (left, back, right, forward), the radius of the circle is a lot bigger compared to doing it in regular elite.

I don't like being able to shoot rockets. most of the time when I hit the rockets its because I was trying to hit an opponent and he shot a rocket, it's always easier to dodge them. hitting them is a waste of a shot too, and if they push you, and you shoot a rocket, they have more of an opportunity to push you.

Walljumps feel random. They seem like they don't work half the time. You should be able to select what direction you want to move by the key you hold.

I'll comment on the rest the more I play.

Good post, but personally I don't think 'having one to spam' is a good case to make in a competitive shooter. Nothing should come down to spam, the reduction puts a bigger emphasis on aim and precision.

[ylem]

I agree with every point, except:
1. Checkpoints
7. Defense with 3 rockets
9. Laser vs Rockets
While checkpoints are not a big minus (but they still are a minus), i would really NOT implement points 7 & 9.

[Omnixor]

for sure your opinion is very imporant and well argumented, I fully agree with you!!1 [/sarcasm]

[slugish]

1. Checkpoints
One of the big drawbacks to this game, in my opinion, is the lack of map control. In many competitive shooters, this was/is the primary strategic concern. In a game with no weapon/ammo/powerup pickups, map control becomes a non issue. With Elite, there is really only one area of the map that matters, the goal. While controlling certain choke points and passages is helpful, its still "all about the pole." Checkpoints, at least to an extent, introduce a slightly more developed concept of map control. I'm sure there is tweaking to be done here, but I like the idea.

2. Toss
Maybe I'm just dumb... I have no idea what this is.

3. Inertia and speed
I don't really have any complaints here specific to Elite Exp, but instead just about the game in general. The formulas to determine how much stamina is used and how quickly appear to be, for lack of a better term, "wonky." The rate at which stamina is used appears to be determined in part by what material the player is standing on... I have no complaint with this. Sometimes, however, I can almost instantly use all stamina when jumping from a spawnbox only a few feet to the ground, or while in the air. I don't have any true opinion about exactly how this should be determined, only that it should be a little more consistent.

4. Trajectories
Speed loss when changing of trajectory was too strong before, I will use the Exp setting. It will make a feeling of gain of speed in the action. (cool)

5. Walljump
I believe any movement feature present in Elite should be present in all game modes, including the wall jump. I am very glad to see this feature added. The current movement system of Shootmania seems geared toward traversing large distances quickly, but the "advanced" movement system seems mostly useless at close range. As many of you have surely encountered, the most useful movement philosophy for mid/close range fighting is simply strafe and hide behind things. Hopefully walljumps will add another useful option for fighting at this distance.

I am not a fan of using the same button for walljumping as for stamina/jump, and believe it would make slightly more sense with the standard "double tap away from the object" approach. I don't really like the term wall"jump" either... I believe wall"dodge" makes a little more sense. I would enjoy having no limitation regarding timing for walljumps, i.e., being able to wait for the peak of the jump, or "dodging" off walls while falling. As for limiting walljumps to only castle walls... this just seems strange to me. If the walljump does indeed make int into the regular gametype, this could be limiting for map designers. I would prefer walljumps to be executable from "almost" any surface. Overall, I love this feature!

6. Laser jump
While I have no complaints about the laser jump, I have yet to find it useful. Perhaps more planning would have to be taken when designing maps, but I'm not sure that I see the point. Perhaps if the height/distance were tweaked a little, it could become more useful?

7. Defense with 3 rockets
I definitely prefer the four rocket version. While others are using the term "spam," I prefer the term "suppressive fire" when it is applicable. With only three rockets, defenders have to hold onto their rockets until the last second. Many rounds end with the attacker waiting ~15-20 meters away while the defender hides behind the pole until the attacker rushes in at the last second. The defender doesn't really have the option of firing at the attacker until he is almost on top of him due to the low rocket count. My opinion: either go back to four rockets, or increase the recharge rate slightly.

8. Progressive jump
Though the concept is neat, it has been more frustrating than helpful so far. Maybe I could get used to it eventually, but I haven't been able to spend much time in the servers due to the small number of people playing EXP. Though I'm ok with or without this feature, I would vote against it.

9. Laser vs Rockets
It sounds like you are aware of the issues with lack of confirmation, this is good at least. This is another one of those things that seemed like a great idea until I tried it. As it stands, most occurrences of cancelling are either due to an accident or to more skilled players "showing off" by shooting rockets that they do not need to shoot. Reducing the hitbox would indeed decrease both of these events, but it would also make it difficult enough that I'm not sure of its practicality. I vote against this. (If I get a vote, that is)

[Forgot10]

Every game I play, every map I play, I end up repeatedly shooting people with rockets, and they disappear inside their bodies, or they disappear AND a hit spark flares up, but the game registers no actual hit. I have similar complaints from some serious players I play with.

Aye, quite a problem it is. I don't really notice that when playing myself, but watching my team mates in attack, I saw it multiple times: rocket disappears when it should have hit the model, and no hit recorded for defender.