Maniaplanet Forum

I think the underlying mechanics of the wooden blocks need to change. As zegodzila mentions, you can't at all turn on them, so they're only useful when going in a straight line. The fact that you can't move on them at all when they are flat and not moving is also really silly, you just get rather stuck on them (not completely stuck thankfully).

The other weird thing I noticed with them: you can't use your stamina when you are just above those wooden blocks, even if you are not touching them!

It's also a shame that stamina has no use with these blocks.

It's a bit tricky to come up with a good implementation of these blocks. A suggestion follows, but it's not completely satisfactory: make the normal movement on wooden blocks closer to normal movement on other blocks but with added slip (so you still slip down slopes but to a much more limited extent), and only once you press the jump button do you start really sliding and gaining momentum, and this uses stamina.

I agree with the idea above ^^
To me flat wooden blocks and crossroads have no use atm. So they should work as standard blocks, maybe just with a little more inertia. And the momentum should be only on down slopes, but maybe a bit faster than it is now.
For the stamina, I don't think it's a good idea to consume it and have no more left at the "end
jump". It rather should reload during momentum.

And about the bouncing rockets, I think the camping / waiting idea doesn't fit the "fast paced" SM gameplay. To me it would have bee better if it was working only on specific surfaces, like i.e. on the new tech pillars blocks, signs, or something that we'd be able to put on walls like black/white marks. So the map creator could place hem in a useful and balanced way.

Talking about blocks : the texture of the new "fast bridges" is too close to the safezone. For the beginner, it should rather be 4 types of "tech surfaces" textures types :
- one for lasers
- one for shields (maybe close to the laser one, but with different lighting shape, i.e. triangle for laser and circle for shield)
- one for fastblocks (same for air and ground)
- one for safezone

Fix climbing on decorated cliff blocks (the big ones)

+ Some blocks missing IMO (not urgent, but will be apreciated):
- shieldpads for grass, with no borders at all...
- soft slopes for ground to air fastways, not only the edgy one.
- one-way escape from safezone
- grids that fit the big squared castle block size
- pillar and different heights for lights

And some more terraforming for castle walls and bridges :
- bridges not only on water cliffs, but all cliffs.
- wall superpositions (windows and stuff) possible when the wall is put on two terraformings.

That's a good idea about charged rockets. I'm still not convinced they are very useful, but as Toninus said they could be activated either by standing on a block, or by designated spots on walls that make shots bounce without needing any kind of charging. Fits in better with the general theme and pace of the game.

zegodzila wrote:

kriouf wrote:
I continue to say that previous rocket was just perfect rocket ever.

Totally !

Agree

I am still in the "NO to destroyable rockets" camp after more Elite. :p All arguments were listed before, by myself and others.

Walljump is a good feature.

As for progressive jumps, I don't see any problems with them.

Charge shot is rather useless right now (at least in Elite).

I add some argument why the previous rocket was the best:

They was slower and you hit if you do predictive shots. Now, under 3 meters the rocket are so fast that you just need to aim the guy to hit, just like railgun. They dont need predictive shot anymore.
Previous rocket was also better balanced because a good attacker could aim and straff to avoid rocket. Now they are too fast, and fired too fast. there is no more spacing between rocket.

On the past i developped the trick to shot one rocket on the feet of the guy to bump him in the air to better predict the next area i need to shot my next rocket. It was so insane when masterised.
Now, under 3 meters you just need to shot directly at him.

Gameplay Sound

4. Sound: maybe we will have to make it louder until we can split the ambiance sound and gameplay sound in the volume settings.

Hylis, just one thing. You cant just add a bar settings for the gameplay sound. Why ? because the sound of the rocket or the railgun is very higher than footstep, If you add this bar setting, footsteps will be easiyer to hear but other sounds like rocket or railgun will be much too strong. And you know, if you split ambiance volume and gameplay volume, all player, all its obvious, will desactivate the ambiance sounds like on other game. I know you dont want it for shootmania.

i suggest to increase the gain of the footstep sound, and increase the rolloff of this sound. Rolloff is the area of this song will be heard.

I've played about 10 hours the last 2 days, and more before then. Although I had the issue with Rail shots lagging, I believe I can give valid feedback.

Rail vs Rockets
In the beginning everyone struggles with this change. However, I see many are already used to it, and have no problem shooting down an entire barrage of rockets before killing someone. I'm also getting the reflex to instantly shoot after getting that "+0" and the rocket hit sound.
Attacking on the usual paths will get you killed more easily. But if you adapt, you can win attacking rounds easily if you have the skill.
Also, the faster rockets are better. I don't see problems dodging if you focus. But it's more possible to hit the attacker from far if he is busy fighting rockets from all sides

New Physics
It makes the game feel smoother and faster. Just like in Trackmania, faster is more fun!
I don't understand why some people complain about being able to jump 1cm to move fast... In Quake you can instantly move fast with circle strafe jump.
Grass is still slower, but as with all new things, you just have to adapt to the fact that your opponents can move faster than before.
Removing progressive jump and the new physics would make this game boring.

Walljump
Another thing that needs to be mastered. Already the top players seem to have mastered it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-G3dWkx46u8
I especially liked what one shoutcaster said in other words: "The walljump makes this game much more interesting to play and watch. Now the attacker can come from any direction, whereas before the defenders knew exactly where he came from and could just camp and spam rockets".
Whoever complains about walljumps, as with the new physics and rail-vs-rockets, just doesn't know how to adapt and wants things to remain the same forever... Please don't change the walljump at all!!! There is quite some depth to learning all the tricks, and removing that removes depth to the game.

The sound
Overall nice! I like the new ambient sounds. However, not being able to hear an opponent even when he is running right behind you is kind of annoying. If that's how it's supposed to be, then so be it. It's just something that makes the gameplay deeper.
However, I get the feeling that it's not supposed to be this way.. Right?

Bouncing rockets
Due to the fact that it takes so long to load it's quite unusable in matches, so I haven't gotten to use it properly except when I'm trolling around.

==================================================================================

Overall a wonderful update that made the gameplay deeper and more fun and that made it way more fun to spectate!!!!.
As people learn to use the tricks properly, you will stop seeing complaints. There are always those who fight against any changes because they are unable to adapt.

I hope you won't reverse any of the changes, except tweaking the bouncing rockets loading time and perhaps bringing back tree climbing and opponent footstep sounds

Otherwise:

EDIT JUMPS:
I dont see the problem with jumps? only bad players dont like new jumps and ask a new key to full jump WHY ? because it is harder and require more timing and more skill to use.

I'm sorry but I don't think Talespin nor me are bad players compared to you. Your argument is far from being valid especially considering that not all the top players come on this forum to tell what they think (wich is for 80% of them the same thing as us).

For my part i love the new jumps! can get the stamina speed with a litle smart jumps of 10cm high instead of 1m50 is very nice !

This is exactly the reason why it's bad. It's far from being skilled, it's just taping the spacebar and run away/in without having to make the choice between jumping or not.

They was slower and you hit if you do predictive shots. Now, under 3 meters the rocket are so fast that you just need to aim the guy to hit, just like railgun. They dont need predictive shot anymore. Previous rocket was also better balanced because a good attacker could aim and straff to avoid rocket. Now they are too fast, and fired too fast. there is no more spacing between rocket. On the past i developped the trick to shot one rocket on the feet of the guy to bump him in the air to better predict the next area i need to shot my next rocket. It was so insane when masterised. Now, under 3 meters you just need to shot directly at him

The previous rockets were too slow and made a lot of situations random. At mid range, a good attacker will never take any rocket because he will dodge them all, and you can't bump him then shoot him in the air since there will be too much time between your next rocket that aim the guy in the air and him hiting the floor again. Yes it was better for the attacker before, not because it was more skilled, but because as a defender hiting rockets at a certain range was 80% random.

All I see from your posts are personal complains, not argued properly at all from a neutral point of view.

I'm sorry but I don't think Talespin nor me are bad players compared to you. Your argument is far from being valid especially considering that not all the top players come on this forum to tell what they think (wich is for 80% of them the same thing as us)

Totaly unapropriate, i dont want to play who got the bigger one
I got the feedback from some of the best SM player, and they agree with me.

This is exactly the reason why it's bad. It's far from being skilled, it's just taping the spacebar and run away/in without having to make the choice between jumping or not.

Its more dynamic, it rox. The stamina bar is not infinite, the player cant abuse of it.

The previous rockets were too slow and made a lot of situations random. At mid range, a good attacker will never take any rocket because he will dodge them all

You said it all, thanks you very much, a skilled attacker will never take it, this is what we want.

you can't bump him then shoot him in the air since there will be too much time between your next rocket that aim the guy in the air and him hiting the floor again.

I'v never had problem with that, it worked great and required good aim and predictive skills. no random.

Yes it was better for the attacker before, not because it was more skilled, but because as a defender hiting rockets at a certain range was 80% random.

now its not ? its same thing at high distance.

All I see from your posts are personal complains, not argued properly at all from a neutral point of view.

All are argued, go read, and dont say its complains. And as i said, one of the best sm players agree with me.

To finish, its not the place to debate, its place to feedback not to attack other players.
thanks.

Its more dynamic, it rox. The stamina bar is not infinite, the player cant abuse of it.

Being able to go faster without having to think does not make the game more dynamic. It's like saying racing games are more dynamic if you go 100kmh straight line rather than 70kmh with curves. Again, your argument is a personal opinion.

You said it all, thanks you very much, a skilled attacker will never take it, this is what we want.

Don't cut half my argument. Skilled attacker will never take it AAAAAAAAAND defenders will shot in the wind hoping that the attacker does a mistake, wich is dumb.

I'v never had problem with that, it worked great and required good aim and predictive skills. no random.

Again, this is NOT POSSIBLE. Don't try to say that you can, because you can't. THIS IS NOT POSSIBLE TO "BUMP THEN HIT" at mid range because the rockets are too slows. Your argument just show how low your game understanding is.

now its not ? its same thing at high distance.

At high distance yes like before, but now it's not random anymore at close/mid range, so it's better overall.

All are argued, go read, and dont say its complains. And as i said, one of the best sm players agree with me.

Your feedbacks will only make sense when you will give names. Until then they are just personal complains that you want to backup with this sentence.

I'm attacking you because your feedbacks don't make any sense, you are just blindly arguying (and really badly btw) agains't 95% (the 95%, not 100% is really important) of the top players that perfeclty know what's up with the game.