The Titlepacksystem - The False Prophet

[kata78]

I made a title pack "Maximum 30 Seconds" and i MADE A TUTORIAL how to install it:


Click here:
http://tm2tutorial.de.tl

So i think the problems are:

1.) Install is too complicated for casual players. They don't even know about title packs ...

2.) I put a track from the solo campaign to tm.mania-exchange.com and there are more than 100
downloads in the moment. Registrated users for the title pack : about 80.

Assuming that not everybody who has the title pack downloads tracks in exchange, i think there at
at least 50 or more players which downloaded the track, but couldn't play it.

I have a second account with no valley (i will buy in summer sales of course) and tried it out.
If you click "Download & Play" it downloads the map, everything is fine, then a message like:
"You don't have the "Maximum 30 Seconds" Title Pack installed." which is ok, so the player knows.
BUT there is a button with "MORE INFORMATION" if you click it, nothing happens ... so map is not played
because user doesn't know how.

NADEO did a lot of work for the update to Maniaplanet 3. As track/mod/title builder i see all the great
changes they have made ... but casual player has no idea ...

Solution: Easier user interface especially main menu is much too complicated for casual players and better support for downloading title packs.

And also if you go on a server with title pack, download should start automatically before entering...

best regards
Kata

[MrA]

I don't think the demo will make Maniaplanet grow really quickly

So in which case, why am I making maps or paying for servers to exist? For who? Where is the players?



I'm getting tired of the endless suggestion that tomorrow is the next destination. I have 2 dedicated servers to pay for, one runs mania exchange and trackmania exchange websites and its mostly covered by donations and adverts (way less by adverts since Stadium came to MP)... The other server I pay for myself and it runs various game servers for MX and TMX and some of my own (knockouts, PPO, MapsOfTheWeek lobby) ... why am I doing this?

Even my own considerable patience on this is running thin. We need players. I don't care what you do to get them, but the longer we wait, the less chance anyone will still be here to welcome them if they ever arrive.

[magnetik]

BUT there is a button with "MORE INFORMATION" if you click it, nothing happens ... so map is not played
because user doesn't know how.

This is not normal, if you click on "More information", the store should open on your title directly, and if the user clicks on "DOWNLOAD", once it's downloaded it's automatically installed in a station.

[The_Big_Boo]

2. There is 3 games only with 50 times of players on Steam, and the 3 are from Valve

If you take Maniaplanet as a whole, yes. If you take each environment separately, it's already 9 games with 50 times more players (and thanks to Stadium, it's only 9).

[kripkee]

Well..

Nothing against your system, but beginner don't start with modding skills or a knowledge of a progammer language for ManiaScript and create instandly a titlepack. You (Nadeo) show us very successfull how you can splitt each kind of "cool" title in "forever alone" gamemode (Royal ). Here we have Shootmania Storm, but for what do I need them, if I want play "elite" - "royal" - "joust" and so on? I think I don't need Shootmania Storm for playing Infection or the BattleMode anymore. If I want to build a elite map, I have to go to elite, if I want build a royal map, I have to got to Royal. In ShootmaniaStorm I can change the modes, but only the modes which are compatible for the "main"game. I understand, that you have for combo some extra objects and this is quite usefull for sure - but it is an extra title [...].

Now the same "problem" with Trackmania² - you have the main game, Plattform (which is empty (does it even work?^^)), Stunters (thx for this guy who create it) and the playerbase is ~ 0 of this extra titles.

I don't want believe that the universal demo fix this issue, if the demo user has only 20 minutes for each TM²-Enviroment-title for the next days to test the game and all this "features". For Shootmania Elite has the demo-user 1h to use this gamemode? why not for other modes? (Pls correct me if I'm wrong here). And after all this, the demo-user has to install different titlepacks with maybe more than 100MB+ ?^^ respect (Pls don't compare games with more than 30 GB Download, thx )

I have currently the feeling that ManiaPlanet is just a star in the universe which search other stars to connect them and the "main" games are only the starairports for these stars..^^

[Hylis]

MrA, I knew when I made the quote that the "really quickly" could raise some questions.

Yes there are next step, and no I can not predict the speed in which the player base can grow. I think that Shootmania & Maniaplanet are less known today that when we released Nations, that the "free to enter" competition is much bigger, and that we also have TM1 that is part of this competition (which is some sort of the proof of the 'forever' quality) So, because of these parameters, I can not predict.

Nations arrived in early 2006, Trackmania in late 2003.
"Demo" of Maniaplanet arrived in summer 2014, Maniaplanet arrived in summer 2011.

Never in that time we had players really not patient for the audience and the features of Maniaplanet are of a scale bigger than what we had at that time. Each time we have to increase the size of map, I think about you and the server hosting constraints. Tell me why there is such low number of posts that talk about the role of keeping these constraints. How many effort we are doing to make the system smooth for bandwith (CDN, inside pack download, map size limit etc.)

Patience is maybe harder than before Nations, even if the audience were much lower and more splitted, because of the negative players. It's maybe strange that they do not include themselve in their own list because they feel that by staying there year after year, making negative posts, they are somehow proving the games deserve to stay for long, even compared to top 9 games.

MrA, we had good fun even before Nations and I believe we will have good fun after the demo. I hope the audience will raise, but I can not predict. And whatever happens, I have other steps. I can not say, or do better!

Kripkee, the rules of the demo are different, and if they are bad, we will adapt, of course.

[meuh21]

Patience is maybe harder than before Nations, even if the audience were much lower and more splitted, because of the negative players. It's maybe strange that they do not include themselve in their own list because they feel that by staying there year after year, making negative posts, they are somehow proving the games deserve to stay for long, even compared to top 9 games.

+1
Sometimes it is discouraging
And negative people are much more disturbing for the game than the title pack system...

Now the same "problem" with Trackmania² - you have the main game, Plattform (which is empty (does it even work?^^)), Stunters (thx for this guy who create it) and the playerbase is ~ 0 of this extra titles.

Platform worked well. The solo campaign was awesome. Lot of fun for me. Now people play in other titles. That's fine and normal because they can stay in the Maniaplanet but they also change of game. WTC for example is great. And the player base is not 0. And the WTC Cup is very funny. Of course people who play in WTC title are happy, even if they are not thousands. Even if negative people write they are nothing.

It's strange because people who really study title packs system are happy with it. Lazy players aren't happy ? No problem just play the "pure" game. That's fine. But please don't break the creator stuff

I am a cow but some people in the community are sheeps. Someone write title pack is not good and many people follow him. Think by yourself or be confident in Nadeo, don't follow the easy way of criticism It is a too easy way...

But don't worry positive part of the community , at the same time many people very enthousiastic are creating cool stuff for the Maniaplanet Just a few examples with the Maniacenter team, with the DD railway title pack (another way of thinking for titlepacks), Stunters, RPG, WTC, Wasteland 2, awesome models in Maniapark, Valley City, nice videos (like this new one from Rickardrick : http://youtu.be/VZCZa751fcM ), etc.

Choose your camp "camarade"

[TheM]

I am a cow but some people in the community are sheeps. Someone write title pack is not good and many people follow him. Think by yourself or be confident in Nadeo, don't follow the easy way of criticism It is a too easy way...

I find that too easily said. We could also call you a sheep by following Nadeo where-ever they go.
Everyone has the right to put his/her opinion here and saying that they're just following someone is doing like they are not important.
We will just have to wait and see what Nadeo gives us, but that doesn't withheld us from being critical at the same time. Though there are enough players that enjoy all creative stuff about ManiaPlanet, many people in the community want more players to share the game, play the game, compete in the game, create more in the game and have more fun.

[TGYoshi]

...

Enough custom content creation is halted because of them. For solo campaigns they may work okay, but the world is larger then that. If you want to make a single map with some custom object, would you make a whole titlepack for it? Who would bother to install it for a single map? For single maps it's just convenient to open the map -> "This map needs xxxxx, download now?" -> play the map instantly. Or so.
Same for servers, especially in SM. The new weapons stuff is amazing. What stops me from using them? Titlepacks are needed to share the content. It's probably just a single server running a fun gamemode with a handful of weapons (or even a single weapon...). If it's hidden in a titlepack it's also much harder to get people to try it out (not shown in server lists as nobody owns the title), or even know it exists in first place... How many people know Combo exists? Or even know how to install it?

It's not convenient for smaller scale projects. If anything, it completely disallows smaller scale projects.

[meuh21]

You're maybe right, i am not a cow but a sheep. But if I am a sheep, it is a black sheep because i am very often in the minority

If i wrote sheep, it's because very often, and not only in this subject but many times in Shootmania topics for example, we can read : Nadeo should do this or this because other games are doing like this. Or also it was like that in TMU so just do the same... I can't understand this way of thinking. Is it interesting if every games are the same ? I like diversity. I love the "Nadeo way" also because it is their own way, because they are thinking by theirself, because they are not followers. Maybe they are also black sheeps

Innovations is more difficult but much more interesting. For developpers and of course for players.

We will just have to wait and see what Nadeo gives us, but that doesn't withheld us from being critical at the same time. Though there are enough players that enjoy all creative stuff about ManiaPlanet, many people in the community want more players to share the game, play the game, compete in the game, create more in the game and have more fun.

Better than just wait, everybody can think about what he can do for the game. And much easier, what he shouldn't do... Because a good and friendly attitude with Nadeo and with the TM fans is good for the game, is good to say welcome to new players. Especially now just before a demo.

I will stop to write in this subject because i think i have nothing more to write (and too much english for me in a few days ) . I explained the reasons why i love title system and why i think it's the easiest way for players to have fun with maniaplanet features. So i prefer now support projects like Maniacenter (ex Infomania). Because even if some people criticize them at the beggining ( http://forum.maniaplanet.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=25175 ) they keep their motivation

Good luck also to title creators