MAPS FOR ESWC

[51chicken]

Assaulting him with cake actually isn't BAD, it's just WAY TOO BIG. I think the author could cut out 25% of that map and make it playable for competitive play.

As far as mindcontrol....it's bad, remove it. I'd really like to know who actually voted this in, nobody even considers that competitive and it's another map with a huge area that's never used.

[TORAKI]

i don't know if you took a look at maps like mindcontrol or assaulting him with cake.. i already stated in a previous post : by a spectator point of view wich knows the game, i think is clear this maps are random , big and useless apart from pole zone.. so we are clear here that from a spectator who knows the game point of view we have a negative response;
from a spect who doesn't know the game we have big maps with alot of features in it , wich are NOT gonna be used by players who are gonna play strictly the pole zone vs defenders covered behind walls around the pole.. where's the excitement in that? the spectator it's just gonna understand nothing apart the 20% of the map zone in wich the pole is.. why waste other previous good maps wich offer a better reaction to spects in spite of this maps wich absolutely makes no sense?

How is mindcontrol too random? You really didn't read this whole thread, I wrote a long post about it.

I don't feel like replying to this thread anymore, I can't take people like you guys serious.

mindcontrol it's like way big but we are actually playing ONLY THE POLE ZONE , a guy behind the electric water wall, a guy behind the wall IMMEDIATLY next to the pole, a guy on the bridge or on the right zone of the pole where there is like a small arch.. u want me to upload a picture of that? the arrow it's absolutely useless such as the 70% of the map now if u want to act like a dick and take it personal go ahed im giving the exact feedback of the map , and im actually practicing on it


EDIT : here you go. i also forget to mention the the attacker have way more space of manouver then the defenders to actually backup on the pole wich is also heavily restrained by all that laser wall light stuff around the pole (i don't know what that is sorry )



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[TORAKI]

@bas_ekkelenkam
plus, not to be disrespectful because obviously i don't know you as a player and ofcourse i appreciate your work.. but actually how much exp u got in elite? cause seems to me not that much ( not that i am super duper pro just sayin ) otherwhise you would be talking different here

[bas_ekkelenkamp]

you know a lot about making Trackmania/Obstacles maps and beautiful creations but not much about competitive FPS/Elite maps.

This is not true, I do know about competitive FPS and Elite maps and I do know how Elite is played competitively. First of all, I am in fact trying to make Elite maps which are actually playable even in a competitive scene. Ofcourse I know the gameplay is really really important when making an Elite map. For example in Mindcontrol, I went for a totally different structure as your usual Elite map, and with this I mean not only making it just look good, but gameplay-wise it is a whole lot different aswell.. Which I did on purpose. For example there are less random placed blocks but instead some larger designed structures, providing more anti-camp gameplay. Most of the Elite competitive maps existing today are really campable, for example a fence near the pole area, where the defender just camps for the whole round while laying some spam rockets. That's what I really don't like, just the same gameplay over and over again. I can't see what's fun in that for both playing and watching a stream of a match. Also this type of gameplay style doesn't really need too much "thinkingpower" (Don't get me wrong, there are lots of exeptions). I think what is upsetting some of you is that everyone is just so much used to this style of playing.

I've seen it happen within the competitive Elite community, lots of you guys think "different" means "bad", and just assuming it won't work in the first place, even if you just played a couple rounds on it or not even having tested the map at all. Everything takes a while getting used to, people had to get used to the other new maps in other mappacks when they were just released. It's a real pity seeing that the community is really close-minded about almost everything, while there is so much more possible in shootmania, and seeing everyone just playing on the same old boring ugly maps is kind of depressing to see for me.

Anyways, I appologise for trying to expand and explore shootmania's boundaries.
Have fun online, and good luck to all the future ESWC competitors.

p.s
(If any of you desire I can explain what my goal was while creating "assaulting them with cake" gameplay-wise)

[dreammyw0w]

put the map in a vote or poll.
U cant decide on ur own what map we play in the biggest event for SM. Ty for understanding.

[TORAKI]

you know a lot about making Trackmania/Obstacles maps and beautiful creations but not much about competitive FPS/Elite maps.

This is not true, I do know about competitive FPS and Elite maps and I do know how Elite is played competitively. First of all, I am in fact trying to make Elite maps which are actually playable even in a competitive scene. Ofcourse I know the gameplay is really really important when making an Elite map. For example in Mindcontrol, I went for a totally different structure as your usual Elite map, and with this I mean not only making it just look good, but gameplay-wise it is a whole lot different aswell.. Which I did on purpose. For example there are less random placed blocks but instead some larger designed structures, providing more anti-camp gameplay. Most of the Elite competitive maps existing today are really campable, for example a fence near the pole area, where the defender just camps for the whole round while laying some spam rockets. That's what I really don't like, just the same gameplay over and over again. I can't see what's fun in that for both playing and watching a stream of a match. Also this type of gameplay style doesn't really need too much "thinkingpower" (Don't get me wrong, there are lots of exeptions). I think what is upsetting some of you is that everyone is just so much used to this style of playing.

I've seen it happen within the competitive Elite community, lots of you guys think "different" means "bad", and just assuming it won't work in the first place, even if you just played a couple rounds on it or not even having tested the map at all. Everything takes a while getting used to, people had to get used to the other new maps in other mappacks when they were just released. It's a real pity seeing that the community is really close-minded about almost everything, while there is so much more possible in shootmania, and seeing everyone just playing on the same old boring ugly maps is kind of depressing to see for me.

Anyways, I appologise for trying to expand and explore shootmania's boundaries.
Have fun online, and good luck to all the future ESWC competitors.

p.s
(If any of you desire I can explain what my goal was while creating "assaulting them with cake" gameplay-wise)

A. have you seen the picture i posted? you obviously failed if your intent was about anti camping defence because THERE ARE spots to camp, like it should be in every logic defence

B. you actually think u can make a map where the attacker has all the space in the world , + has stamina wich is itself a big advantage on the defender , and make no cover for defender? how a defender is actually able to defend? explain that to me cause really it's not clear

C.seems to me you wanna turn shootmania into another game because your not innovating maps you are just chaning EVERYTHING turning what it was a 1on1 attacker vs defender push situation into an attacker HUNTING DOWN/chasing defender wich have no covers all over the map . ALL THIS risult into lots of attack going down in a official match and no possibilites of defence FOR THE ACTUAL level of skill in the elite scene..im telling you everybody appreciate your job and struggle to try and make a new map , but trust us if we tell you IT'S NOT BALANCED and don't take it PERSONAL it's not professional.

i can easily make 4 attacks in a row in maps like this , and im not even the most skilled guy in the game , players from top teams like guys from aAa , mouz or lemondogs will play this map like they are playing public against ranks 5000 ; and u think that makes the game more exciting?.. so reflect and jump to your conclusion otherwhise i will explain again and try and make myself more clear

[iMerkuuu]

And now playing elite is like playing obstacle...and I play a lot obstacle

[Sephis]

It's more about to have maps watchable for spectators (like not using rooftops because with the global cam they can't see nothing). If you have a very good map but the spectators can't see not much, it's not so cool to watch and to understand the actions (or worse to miss them), that's why it's important to take this into account when an Elite map is created.

http://uppix.com/f-roof520135120013973a.jpg

[TORAKI]

It's more about to have maps watchable for spectators (like not using rooftops because with the global cam they can't see nothing). If you have a very good map but the spectators can't see not much, it's not so cool to watch and to understand the actions (or worse to miss them), that's why it's important to take this into account when an Elite map is created.

as sephis pointed out,what you don't what to happen is is exactly what you are achieving : )

[bas_ekkelenkamp]

Oh sorry tokari, I said something before in this thread about camping aswell, I should have showed you this. Also, I'm not taking anything posted here personally so don't worry about that. Thanks for mentioning it though.

How can the defenders not "camp" when the objective of the defence team is to defend the pole? Are you expecting them to just go around jumping like rabbits and firing blue balls at the attacker?

You have to have this playstyle if you want to win and at the end of the day the competitive scene of SM plays to win, even with these ridiculous lolhueg maps you will see "camping" because it's what works. In fact what's funny is that you will see even more "camping" on the new ones and I don't even need to explain why.

You've no grills on your maps, it's cool, I don't like grill but I already find 3 safe/close pos near the Pole on MindBlowing where player can "camp".
then, 50% of your map is useless.

I did not mean to get rid of camping completely, ofcourse there gotta be plently of walls to hide behind, and a variation of more stuff. When I said camping I was more thinking of when a defender would just stick to one position for the whole round, or just sticking to the pole until the time runs out. I have seen this happen even more than I expected when watching a stream. As you've probably already seen on Mindcontrol I used the thin black lights around the pole. These will only cover a defenders feet and small part of its legs, making themselves vulnerable if they try to hide behind it.

Also.. Since so many of you are complaining I was thinking of maybe trimming down both Mindcontrol and Assaulting, since I have to agree with you they're both quite big.

On mindcontrol
my idea is to remove the general area around the arrowpad, since it's indeed going to be kind of useless.
Also, you have been complaining about the roof around the pole area, and I can see why this would be a bit silly to watch from above while watching a stream. So maybe removing that roof?
And maybe providing a bit more cover for the defenders.

On Assaulting them with cake
Trim down some parts behind the the defender spawn, some other parts on the right and left side. Just generally reducing the size of the map a bit. click here for a screenshot of the areas I'd like to remove. (areas circled red)

What do you think? And if you have any more suggestions to improve both maps, don't hesitate to tell me,I'd love to hear them. (instead of all the hating comments, they're getting a bit depressing and will get you nowhere.)