direction

[i7mean]

I wouldn't compare Valve with Nadeo (and CS with TM) but okay... And from my posts what I pointed out wasn't that I didn't want new creative tools, it's that way too less players are using them just because way too less players are playing the actual game (so not talking about the competitive aspect neither). So this is why I as a player, wasn't happy with the previews you gave us for the moment. I'm sure others as creators, are happy about it, but tho when they'll figure out that a very little amount of people are interested in this, I think they'll be disappointed (my POV).

To summarize :

Dear Nadeo, we understand the pedigree of TrackMania and we know the pedigree of TrackMania
We don't understand the content of the previews and we don't know where the game is going

Btw I said "we", maybe I should have said "I" but you got the message

[Gomme]

By the way, the first competitions happened even before the first release, thanks to the demo. I was second to FredoLeDingue I think.

but i knew that, you already told the story ! i started to play the demo at the end of summer 2003. i even remember i visited fredoledingue's website to check if i was far or not from the "nadeo times" on some difficult tracks. i finally bought the game in 2004 because i was still playing the demo as i really found the game entertaining and challenging.
New stuff you can't talk about ?? *raises an eyebrow really high*

[Skadi]

i7mean is more or less right. I share my opinion with his about the fact that we currently lack a bigger community (=players + creators + spectators).

Thus, as a player/mapper/spectator/whatever, I don't understand how these last previews will grow our community if you don't even solve existing problems/requests. I mean, you probably did respond to few requests but from my point of view, you didn't respond to the biggest/oldest requests of ours yet. That's why I'm pointing out your "wrong" order of priority. Also, you have to think that:
- creations can't be done/are useless if there is no player to play these creations
- spectators can't watch anything if there is no player

Nowadays, there are quite a lot of creators (mappers, videomakers, skinners,...) compared to two others; we're slowly losing players and spectators at the moment so you should focus on this first.

Hopefully you'll get my point and will respond quickly.

PS: you locked my topic about "How NADEO deals with existing problems" even though I didn't have time to reply... I didn't wish a debate between players nor a private discussion with you. I wished you, NADEO, tell us publicly how you deal with problems and how you list those.

[TMarc]

Although not the optimal solution, the lock is also a way to handle things.
Hylis wants to prevent further discussion on things which are not clear now, and which will be clearer in future with the changes in Maniaplanet.

Besides this, I share the observation of i7mean an Skadi.
Only few people really invest time to work deeply with Maniaplanet.
I guess people are either just playing, tired of waiting, or only waiting for really good changes.

We have to avoid to be upset or unhappy.
Please don't forget it is only a game, and games are there for fun, for distraction.
But not for stress.

[hackie]

TMarc : Please don't forget it is only a game, and games are there for fun, for distraction.

Don't get me wrong but " its only a game " sure its a game.
A game payed by real money !!! So at least what we can expect is some support.

[Hylis]

On the first page of the wishlist of MP4, there are 4 times: new blocks request for TM. And we just did a preview with new blocks.

And I read: "at least we can expect some sort of support?" We are bringing quite a lot of work for the update, we will have work to do also in the beta of this free update, we have scheduled time to work on update after the release etc.

Skadi first wish is to have a false start system in Trackmania. I am sure some players can have a debate with him before having him to tell us that we don't want to make Trackmania great.

Like I said from the beginning, it will be difficult to understand the trajectory we are taking to go after having a popular game, and it's normal since I can not talk about the future etc. So, it's like you wish to tell me that you don't understand or that we are wrong of where we are going, while you can't see it.

It's not making any good. So, let's talk on discord one day or another if you wish me to explain how I believe our trajectory is the best one to make the game popular, and be prepare to have a lot of "for reasons I can't tell for now" in the explanations.

[Skadi]

About my wishes, I'd like to let you know that I ordered those regarding the "originality". Since some wishes were already about new blocks, I list this as almost last.

As previously said, I don't wish a private talk with you as first priority (no offense in it), I wish you tell us publicly about that. I may understand it's frustrating that from your point of view you responded "our" wishes. Though you may also know that only few TM members use this forum since most barely believes that you're not reading/listening to us and just working on what you think it's good.

That's why I (and some others) try to push you to understand our point of view and realize that your way to make things is not perfect yet...

[Hylis]

most barely believes that you're not reading/listening to us and just working on what you think it's good

There is a big difference between reading, what I do, and listening, which would be irresponsible toward the studio. Reading the players wishes and knowing the people behind it helps me better define the trajectory. This trajectory can not be understood by people that would not know what are the human and technical constraints as well as next big steps.

It was even unknown that we were working on console for some time. I know it could be frustrating and that it's not something cool, but it's misleading to think that I am not reading players wishes and frustrations, that can totally be expressed with a positive spririt. This is why also I ususally asked in the wishlist to be as clear as possible:

Anything that is not in the format of a clear top, with short lines, will be deleted. The goal is to provide a clear picture of what each player wants.

I can easly reply that many players do not even read this, or take it into account themselves.

I should have been more clear in wishlist 4, my mistake

And for these next big steps, you are really welcome to express your wishes, as always: clear & simple, no debate, link to report when possible.

Priority is the most important thing in a wishlist. If someones put it first, it should be "THE MOST" important thing, even if other people already ask for it etc.

A priority #1 should not be taken lightly by people who write their wishes. And this is how it's easier for me, after, to know what is their priority when I read, and eventually take it into account according to our constraints and consequences of doing it.

It's likely that I will open a wishlist inside the beta & very very likely I will open one after the release of MP4, so I will be more clear.

[Skadi]

The difference I know between reading and listening is simply that you take or not into account this one post. You can read everything you want, but if in your mind you think like "I don't care about these posts, I'll do the best for my game as I wish it" (!!!I didn't say you thought like that!!!). But if you listen to what everyone says (by filtering stupidities ofc), you will improve for sure your way to work, because some comments may point out some errors/mistakes you did in the past. And that's how everything stays alive, by evolving over time.

About wishes, tbh I didn't know about this one clear format, but that makes sense to me that every wish must be as clear as possible in order to be read and so you know exactly what people need/wish. Though I did change my list with a new order.