Trackmania² Lagoon Special Beta for Trackmania Turbo PC owners

[Hylis]

Rizu, we are as much Ubisoft than others, and there are various people with various roles and I did not succeeded to convince everybody of the benefit of inviting all TMT owners to MP. And I respect this as well since they have a limited amount of time, ressource and ultimately understanding of our relationship with the community. I believe that with more time everybody would have agreed and I can even be wrong on this.

Xanatori, the ones with the Lagoon beta can keep Lagoon on MP4. And to be careful, I can't even garantee that we will do MP5 btw, even if it's still in our plan to do. So if you buy it in promo for example for the day we release Mp5 and it does not happens, it will another difficult situation. This whole idea was also link to the fact that we were also unable to warn players that we were working on Turbo, and it was for logical reasons. Like tcq explained, between the fact that things can change and players reactions, it's super hard to talk about the future. I even doubt for the first time of making Hello Planet. Sorry for the frustration and bad communication, not sorry for our good intention and what we at least succeeded to do.

[Akbalder]

With Nadeo we are used to see bad communication:
- Before releasing TMT, they didn't talk about the limits preventing the correctly manage the maps and the servers (making the game unusable).
- When announcing the Lagoon beta, they didn't give the date before which should register to the beta.
- They didn't say that it wouldn't be possible to get lagoon for free if we didn't register for the beta.
- The indication "for Maniaplanet 4 only" wasn't clear and we still don't know how long it is supposed to last (Maniaplanet 5 in 6 months or 2 years ?)

The decisions made by Nadeo would be better accepted if there was a good communication to annonce them.


EDIT: Hylis just gave informations about Maniaplanet 5 but it should have been in the original post.

[Hylis]

I don't even know if there will be a MP 5 for sure, I don't know if we will shutdown MP 4 when we will release MP 5. And this is why I said: for MP 4 only.

And yes I realize that I assume the fact that it was through the beta only was clear while it was not. Really difficult to manage the free update of MP4, release of Lagoon and this type of operation at the same time.

At least, even if offices are closed in France I am here to clarify, so this jugement on 'bad' is a little strong. Not saying what will be in Turbo, saying what we wish to do, talking of Hello Planet with 1 year ahead, it's tricky. So, yes there are bad communication, but maybe there is some good communication as well. I will not judge.

[drakargx]

Tx for the real support here.

Rizu, you say it's about principle and you judge us in a way. On my side, this is against my principle. As I have just explained, it was not our call. We have ever been a studio and still are. You even saw that it's a special way to get access to a special version. Of course you can keep your wallet and vote as you wish. But wishes are not always fullfilled, like the one I had to offer the entire Lagoon to all TMT owners, even console. I should have make it clear that it was not in our hands, even if I did not expected this outcome. I bet on logic to win but time of discussion made this too late, and once it's released it unmanagable to pursue since people would have started to buy in various place.

Lastly, I wish you best and to see life and judge people starting to think they do their best, with as much principle as you. And even if I think it's logic, the conclusion may be different than my wish, while it's much more important imo. Have fun elsewhere nonetheless.

Why did you bring it up if it wasn't your call? If you weren't sure that you could do it then it would've been best to not say anything until you're sure it'll happen, this whole mess would've been avoided if you did. As of now this whole thing comes off like it was an attempt to get more TMT sales (a game that was basically created to suck compared to MP trackmania games, even though it has a better business model) while still forcing them to buy Lagoon later on.

[Rots]

Lagoon should have been launched all together with MP4 before the release of TMT trubo (only on consoles, never on PC) and you know it. Thx ubi

[Hylis]

I think it's because I both though it would be done and that I somehow said it when I was saying it was our wish. Not clear enough, but not evil. And you can be hard toward the quality of TMT but I consider it to be a good game that you were not forced to buy. Internally, some people were against releasing on PC, and I was able to convince that the ones without a console may wish to play it and could be angry that a PC studio like us does not support them. They wished to postpone the PC etc. It's discussions with pros and cons, and if you only take the cons in the end we will ever have to apoligize even if we want to make it good. Thinking that we wish to do otherwise would be strange anyway.

And yes, I would have like to release Lagoon before, it would have been simpler. But it's not 'ubi' that made it otherwise, it's just a balance of pros and cons in a given situation. I really want to make it clear that there are tons of parameters. We are 'ubi' as every one else, expect for the top management. But even them have a limited amount of time. And I can tell you they are super great. And Maniaplanet and it's spirit is alive thanks to their great capacity and already huge time they took for it compared to everything they have to manage. Ubi is 12000 people ! We are 40 among them

[loozerr]

The opportunity for a free TM2 Lagoon for TMT owners slipped away now that the beta is over, I take it?

[Hylis]

Yes, it was link to the beta and is also link to mp4, not Mp5 if we do it.

[loozerr]

Oh well, that makes me sad. Anyway, congratulations on the launch of a new title!

[ppgbarc]

You can't say that especially after releasing such a bad game that is TMT.

TMT is one of the best games in the series.

Isn't it better to give the devs a for their hard work and move on with life?

No, because it's not that simple. Nadeo aren't your friends, they're a business. They stated something very clearly, and then decided to throw it away in favor of vague statements about... honestly, I'm not even sure what Hylis is trying to say in that one earlier post. Businesses should not get a pat on the back for such a misleading action.

It's really frustrating to see both Nadeo and fans completely support this, and for reasons that make no sense. They accuse others of judging Nadeo unfairly, they keep trying to say that what Nadeo very clearly said wasn't actually what they said, they keep accusing people of "demanding" things, and they keep saying this has anything to do with the pricetag. The only thing I'm demanding is what was actually stated that I was going to get. It was expressly stated that Nadeo intended to do this deal, and at no point was it stated that there were any obstacles against this until the game finally released. Not only did they not do the deal, but they replaced it with a version that is almost impossible to actually participate in.

Nadeo knew this was going to be a problem, as Hylis has very clearly stated, but they said absolutely nothing until it was too late. I don't understand why they cannot be held accountable for this. I don't understand why this has to be about everything except the actual problem: Nadeo fundamentally lied to people, and are trying to cover it up with every excuse in the book.

rizu completely gets it. Thank you for actually being reasonable about this.